David Chadwick and Suzuki Roshi's Lineage

[00:00:00] Speaker A: For more information on Ancient Dragon Zen Gate, please visit our website at www.ancientdragon.org. our teachings are offered to the community through the generosity of our supporters. To make a donation online, please visit our website. [00:00:16] Speaker B: Welcome. And it's a great pleasure on this springy day to have Dan Layton, our guiding teacher emeritus and scholar and great practitioner of Buddhism, to talk to us about something. So I think I'll hand over the mic to you, Teigen, and take it away. Thank you. [00:00:47] Speaker C: Good morning so you can all hear me. So I want to talk today about David Chadwick, who passed away last week. I think there'll be a memorial chant for him a week from tomorrow. Yes, but first I need to acknowledge something that's happened in the past week. We have yet another war bombing of Iran, bombing of children, counter bombings from Iran throughout the Mideast. Our president has done this illegally without consulting Congress, as the Constitution describes it. And it's just terrible. It's just terrible. Aside from the prevalence of nuclear weapons in the world now and the threat of that, there's just. Well, it's just devastating. And President Trump has unleashed his Gestapo ice on Minnesota and Chicago and Los Angeles and Maine and all kinds of places and has taxed Iran. This is akin to the Iraq war, where for no reason, except maybe for [00:02:19] Speaker D: oil, [00:02:21] Speaker C: we had this devastating war, which we finally lost. And Iran is worse. It's a bigger country, more powerful. It certainly is no help to the people of Iran who've been suffering through [00:02:37] Speaker D: a terrible regime there. But this bombing is not going to help them in any way. [00:02:45] Speaker C: So anyway, it's just a terrible situation. And it recalls the war in Iraq [00:02:53] Speaker D: and in my youth, the war in Vietnam. [00:02:57] Speaker C: And we've had many wars since then. Anyway, the United States and Israel are [00:03:06] Speaker D: rogue nations now around the world. [00:03:10] Speaker C: So anyway, it's. We have to face this and weather it and eventually something else will happen. But there's a tremendous amount of damage [00:03:22] Speaker D: that's being done by this president. [00:03:26] Speaker C: And I could go on about that, but I won't. [00:03:29] Speaker D: You all know about this. [00:03:34] Speaker C: Anyway, I wanted to talk about David Chadwick today. David was passed away from cancer maybe a week ago. And David was a force of nature. David was one of the first priests ordained, early priest ordained by Suzuki Roshi. And he's written a number of books. The first one, thank youk and okay, is about his escapades in Japan and talking about Japan and Extremely funny book. [00:04:06] Speaker D: I was gonna. [00:04:07] Speaker C: I was gonna read a section from [00:04:09] Speaker D: that, but I, But I thought I [00:04:11] Speaker C: would instead talk About Crooked Cucumber, which is the biography that David wrote about his teacher, Shinri Suzuki Roshi. The life and Zen teaching of Shinryu Suzuki. And yeah, David. David was amazing. He was a kind of wild man. He was. When he was at Tassahara, I think it was Baker Roshi who asked him to. To not speak for three months. And that was the loudest silence that [00:04:46] Speaker D: anybody's ever experienced because Damon was just [00:04:51] Speaker C: everywhere and very loudly, even though he was. He didn't speak. So. And I got to know. Well, I knew David from before, but when he was. [00:05:03] Speaker D: When I was living in Japan in the early. When was it, the early 90s, he [00:05:10] Speaker C: was living down in Okayama outside a temple, Rinzai Temple there. And Harada, which Harada Roshi. Anyway, one of the Harada Roshis was the teacher there. And David and his wife Elon and their. And their baby Kelly at the time were living in a house outside, right outside the gates of the temple. So I visited them a number of [00:05:39] Speaker D: times, and it was a great pleasure. [00:05:42] Speaker C: David was such a character. He really was, but he's also a great writer. And so I'm going to read some selections sort of randomly from Suzuki Roshi's biography by David. David also has a new book out called Tassahara Stories, Stories from the Early Years at Tassahara. And he's got a sequel that's coming out in a couple months, I think. More teachings from More stories from Tassahara. Anyway, this first excerpt I'm going to read is about Suzuki Roshi's struggles with English. So Kato helped translate at times, but Suzuki didn't want more assistance than absolutely necessary. His English was ticking off at adult school, which he attended every day. He'd done so well on tests that his English teacher had accused him of cheating. Suzuki bravely began giving talks in English on Wednesday nights. They were brief, 15 to 30 minutes. He spent hours preparing for them. But many listeners, especially those hearing him for the first time, had trouble understanding his English and went away scratching their heads. So my own first teacher, Soto Zen priest in New York in the 70s, Nakajima. Nakajima, his English was pretty bad. He worked downtown in Manhattan, in midtown Manhattan for, I think, Mitsui. So he was only speaking the Japanese [00:07:23] Speaker D: people, and he would give talks in English. [00:07:27] Speaker C: I actually transcribed a lot of his talks for the periodical Zen Life, I [00:07:33] Speaker D: think it was called, that came out from the New York Zen Center. [00:07:38] Speaker C: So I got. So having transcribed his talks, I got [00:07:41] Speaker D: to understand his English better, but it [00:07:44] Speaker C: was pretty hard to understand. [00:07:46] Speaker D: For a lot of people, anyway. [00:07:49] Speaker C: After one of his talks, when he and Kato were alone together in the office, Suzuki took off his okasa, folded and draped it over a chair, then sighed and said to Kato, such a chore. I have to think of what to say. Yes, in English as well as in Japanese, Kato said, looking at the Japanese English dictionary on his desk, the COVID worn and the corners end curled up. But Suzuki's efforts were appreciated. Della understood him right away. To her, he was clearly saying what she already believed. We have what we seek, and the way to find it is just to be ourselves. Betty noticed how much he contradicted himself, coming back around to the opposite of what he'd just said in the same lecture, sometimes even in the same sentence. He just didn't think in a way that she was used to. One week he says we have to put our entire effort into it, she said to Della. And the next week he says, there's no use trying to give. There's no use trying to give up. And the answer will come, will come. No use trying. And you've got to do your damnedest both. So, yeah, it's true, you know, we have to work, effort, sustain ourselves here through zazen periods. And yet it's all about just being yourself, actually. So one of the things I noticed when I first went to San Francisco Zen center after several years with Nakajima, [00:09:46] Speaker D: Reverend Nakajima in New York, was that [00:09:50] Speaker C: the people who had practiced with Suzuki Roshi, who were. Who were the veterans of Zen there, were peculiar and particular and very much themselves. Ed Brown, Reb, Walt Disko. [00:10:08] Speaker D: Well, he wasn't there yet then. He was still on Japan. [00:10:12] Speaker C: Blanche and Lou, anyway, they. [00:10:16] Speaker D: These were people who were particular and peculiar. Jerome, wild Jerome, very tall and kind [00:10:23] Speaker C: of gnomish at the same time, was very much him, very. They were very much themselves. Even though, you know, there was this Zen form that everybody was supposed to, [00:10:39] Speaker D: you know, sit and look the same [00:10:42] Speaker C: and wear robes the same. [00:10:44] Speaker D: And, you know, but anyway, they. They were very particular and peculiar people. [00:10:51] Speaker C: And so this is a practice about just being yourself, even though you may try and be some Zen zombie or some. Some perfect Zen person, it's really just about being yourself. [00:11:07] Speaker D: But how do we do that? [00:11:08] Speaker C: How do we find ourselves on our seats? This is a great mystery, and it's [00:11:16] Speaker D: also easy and it takes a lot of work. [00:11:19] Speaker C: So, anyway, that's one excerpt from Crooked Cucumber. [00:11:25] Speaker D: I'll read another. [00:11:27] Speaker C: And this is an example of Suzuki Roshi being a little bit Wild. Every once in a while, Shinryu Suzuki would do something extreme to dislodge his students from ruts they were in, to knock them off their self satisfied purchase out of their dreamy lives and back into the arena of insecurity where they could rededicate, dedicate, rededicate themselves to, to what he called beginner's practice. One morning, in the midst of the collective and individual harmony that had accrued from their efforts in zazen and practice, when the confidence level was at its zenith, Suzuki made his morning greeting. Walking in gasho around the room behind his students like Hougetsu did this morning, seated on their zafus, he bowed at the altar and assumed his position on the platform facing the room. Just as he did every day in the middle of the period, he got up, straightened a few postures and hit Sleepy Bill Kwong on the shoulders twice each. Just as he did every day. He went back to his seat and resumed sitting. Then all of a sudden, from Suzuki's small frame, roared out the guttural sound of an angry lion. [00:13:06] Speaker D: That's not. [00:13:10] Speaker C: You think you're sitting zazen. You're not sitting zazen. You're wasting your time. [00:13:16] Speaker D: He hopped off his cushion and flew [00:13:19] Speaker C: down the aisles, whacking each person four times, twice on each shoulder, quick as lightning, his robes flying back, creating a tornado in the zendo. Then he was back in his seat in silence. The room of stunned sitters electrified as each bowed to Suzuki in the door on their way out after service. They were a little less sure of themselves. He looked at them squarely, but without a hint of anger, as if everything was normal. Complacency and pride lay shattered on the floor using the stick like this, a traditional practice of Japanese Zen called rensaku. Suzuki would do it from time to time, open with, often without saying a word. So Suki Roshi was very gentle and kind. Actually, this use of the stick, the. The kyosaku, it's not something we do anymore. It's. [00:14:28] Speaker D: It's. [00:14:28] Speaker C: The sound of it is. [00:14:29] Speaker D: Is too alarming for people, so we don't do it anymore. [00:14:33] Speaker C: But you know that there's this spirit of Zen that is fierce and wild in the context of kindness and gentleness. [00:14:45] Speaker D: So you know, we don't. [00:14:48] Speaker C: This practice is just about being soft [00:14:53] Speaker D: and gentle and kind actually, and just finding our way in the middle of [00:14:59] Speaker C: this and being who you are. But occasionally, like on this occasion, Suzuki Roshi would use the kyosaku and we used to use the kyosaku at San Frisco. [00:15:14] Speaker D: Zen center for a while and then stopped. I use it at Tassahara. [00:15:22] Speaker C: It's actually. It actually, you know, you put your hand in Gasho if you want the Kiyosaka now that. That back then. And then you do one express one shoulder and then the other and you get whacked. And it's an art to do it. You have to have to hit right here, not here or here. [00:15:44] Speaker D: So anyway, I. I did that at Tassahara, but we don't use it anymore. [00:15:49] Speaker C: And that's okay. But this just shows that Suzuki Roshi was not predictable and. And at the same time that he was kind and gentle and soft and he was. He could wake people up [00:16:07] Speaker D: and be fierce. So that's a little bit about that. [00:16:12] Speaker C: And then I want to read something from about Pauline Pecci, who was the wife of Graham Pecci, who I. I [00:16:22] Speaker D: don't think I ever met Pauline, but I met them. [00:16:25] Speaker C: Pauline Pechy had never had anything important to talk to Suzuki Roshi about in Dokson. She would ask him theoretical questions like if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, does it make a sound? [00:16:45] Speaker D: It doesn't matter, he answered. [00:16:49] Speaker C: Pauline sat in Sachin. Her legs were killing her. It was tough being the wife of the guy who was sitting, setting the standard. Graham never moved, even in the extra long periods that Suzuki would throw in unexpectedly on occasions. Pauline, on the other hand, was just trying to get through the day without screaming. She sat in the middle of the room and so had an aisle in front of her rather than the wall. During a moment of particular difficulty, she saw Suzuki step in front of her. Something about his feet struck her. She watched them intently as he walked slowly. By then a calm came over her and the pain separated from her. It didn't matter anymore. Her chattering mind dropped away. Standing for Kinhan, she looked around the room as if seeing her fellow students for the first time and realized how trapped they all were in petty social games. She felt love for everyone in the room. She looked at Suzuki and saw him connected with him in this trouble free space, not in the realm of their delusions. So he was just there, connecting with [00:18:26] Speaker D: everyone [00:18:29] Speaker C: in this trouble free space. Soon afterwards, she saw him in Dokson. After bowing three times to the floor, she sat on the cushion facing him. After a moment of following breaths together, she told him about her experience, which she was sure signaled permanent enlightenment. Very nice, he said. You have reached deep, Saen. [00:18:57] Speaker D: So, [00:19:00] Speaker C: yeah, anyway. So those are a few stories from Suki Roshi from Crooked Cucumber. [00:19:09] Speaker D: That David wrote, [00:19:12] Speaker C: he was a good writer, but he was a wild guy. One story I hesitate to tell you [00:19:22] Speaker D: because it sounds cruel, but this was [00:19:25] Speaker C: soon after David's first child. [00:19:28] Speaker D: Now I'm forgetting his name. [00:19:31] Speaker C: Anyway, no, Kelly was his first child. [00:19:33] Speaker D: What's this? [00:19:35] Speaker E: Clay. [00:19:36] Speaker C: Clay was the second child. [00:19:38] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:19:38] Speaker C: But anyway, one time when Kelly was first born, David knew that someone was coming over, and he put Kelly in the refrigerator and told the person coming [00:19:52] Speaker D: over, go get a beer from the refrigerator. [00:19:54] Speaker C: And he opened the door and there was Kelly. He's sitting in the refrigerator, this infant. Anyway, David, he wasn't going to be there long, but David. This was David's sense of humor. So there's so many stories about David, but he was. [00:20:13] Speaker D: He was wild. [00:20:14] Speaker C: And I guess he settled down. He lived in Bali the last years of his life. He came and visited here and gave [00:20:23] Speaker D: a couple talks or so and spent [00:20:26] Speaker C: a week here traveling, going around Chicago, [00:20:31] Speaker D: going to the Art Institute and the Field Museum and places like that, but [00:20:36] Speaker C: also just hanging out in Chicago. [00:20:38] Speaker D: So anyway, [00:20:43] Speaker C: so maybe David settled down [00:20:46] Speaker D: in Bali, but I don't know. I never went to Bali. I didn't see him. He was there the last, I don't know, five or 10 years of his life. [00:20:56] Speaker C: So, anyway, I just thought I would [00:20:58] Speaker D: talk about David a little bit and read you from his book Crooked Cucumber. [00:21:05] Speaker C: And so this is about the early, [00:21:08] Speaker D: early days of San Francisco Sense center and our lineage. We've come a long way since then, but here we are. So any comments or questions or responses? Yes, Nirsan. Well, [00:21:33] Speaker E: Yeah, I do have a comment before I go to that. I would like to acknowledge that David Chadwick is, in addition to these books, is also the person who's formed. I think it's called cuke.com, which has become kind of an archive of, you know, memories and reflections from, you know, people who interacted with Suzuki Roshi over the years. And, you know, there are many, like, talks and things that you wouldn't have encountered otherwise that, that are collected there. So, I mean, he's, he's really done, I think, an invaluable service to, to, to making that available to all of us. [00:22:14] Speaker C: But yeah, and before you continue. Yeah. Just to say about kuke.com. yes, wonderful website with lots and lots of information about Suzuki Roshi and people who knew him in Japan, people who knew him in America, students of his, but also continuing to follow San Francisco Zen Center Suzuki Roshi lineages. So, yeah, there's just a lot of material and David really worked on puke.com to. And I think it will continue. [00:22:48] Speaker D: I think he has made sure that will happen. [00:22:51] Speaker C: So he also constructed a huge archive of talks by Suzuki Roshi. So there are many, many more talks than, you know, in Zen mind, beginner's mind. And he did a couple of books. Zen is here, Zen is now. And so there's just a wealth of [00:23:11] Speaker D: information on cube.com and yes. [00:23:15] Speaker C: So David also took care of the Suzuki Roshi archives, which is a huge resource of talks by Suki Roshi and others about him. So, yes, thank you, Nyazan, for mentioning that. [00:23:29] Speaker E: Yeah, you're welcome. And then I was just going to sort of share one memory of him because I only have one year and I suppose that maybe, you know, I'm guessing it must have been 2010, 2011, something like that. And, you know, I, I had never met him, but I had read the book and American Zen Failure in Japan maybe 15 or 20 years before. And so it was just kind of like, wow, David Chadwick. And while he was here, I'm sure, I think he was staying with Hogesu, if I recall. And, you know, in this building. And, you know, I imagine that you had something to do with this Ty again. But it came to me through you that he would like to do a talk at this group that I used to run at Rockefeller Chapel before most, I'm most of the people here, you know. So I came and picked him up and I took him down. And, you know, you were talking about his wildness. And, you know, I've had only contact with a couple of those people from the early years, you know, him and then Zengu, whom you also mentioned. And, yeah, there's a certain wildness there. But there was also, I was really struck first by David because I hadn't met Paul yet, how lightly they held their. How lightly he held his practice. And I mean, I don't know what I was expecting, but I came up to pick him up and he was, [00:24:54] Speaker D: I don't know, I think he might [00:24:55] Speaker E: have been wearing like a shirt and maybe some overalls. And, you know, he, you know, unlike most of us, he just was wearing his Rockasu. If I recall, there might have been some of, you know, what he'd had for breakfast on that rakasu, you know, you know, just this kind of thing. And we came down and we were, you know, he gave this very generously gave this talk to this group at Rockefeller Chapel. It was well attended, not publicized with him involved. [00:25:23] Speaker F: But there are people there. [00:25:24] Speaker E: And for Those of you who have been there, it's a big, big space, and it's a very resonant space. I mean, if you stand at a hundred yards down at the far end and whisper things, if there's not other [00:25:38] Speaker F: noise going on, people up front can [00:25:40] Speaker E: hear you, you know, so it's got that kind of thing. And somebody during the talk just let out this tremendous sneeze. [00:25:48] Speaker C: Just this tremendous. What? [00:25:50] Speaker E: Sneeze? [00:25:51] Speaker C: Sneeze. [00:25:52] Speaker E: That reverberated. And his response was. His response was, thank you, I want your cold. [00:25:59] Speaker D: And. [00:26:00] Speaker E: And the thing about that was, is he. You would ordinarily hear like, thanks, I want your cold. Like, way to go, dude. You know, cover your mouth next time or whatever it was. But the way he said it was really like, you know, we're in this together. I watched the woman had done this, and it immediately, you know, we do something like, you're old, kind of find himself conscious, put her at ease. And I. I just thought it was great. [00:26:28] Speaker D: Here I am talking about it like, [00:26:30] Speaker E: you know, 15 years later. That was my only contact with him, [00:26:33] Speaker D: but I enjoyed it very much. Yes. [00:26:36] Speaker C: Thank you, Nyazan. And for those of you who don't know, Nyazan led the Wednesday late afternoon zazen at Rockefeller Chapel for many years. And Rockefeller Chapel is this huge cathedral in Hyde park. And. [00:26:54] Speaker D: Yeah, and then there were, you know, [00:26:56] Speaker C: cushions in the front and the naves. [00:26:58] Speaker D: Anyway, it was a great opportunity, so [00:27:01] Speaker C: thank you for that. [00:27:02] Speaker B: Niza Albert, you were there, right? Yes, I went there for many years. Yeah. [00:27:09] Speaker D: Were you there for that occasion? [00:27:11] Speaker B: I am. Nine months, I know it looks like. [00:27:16] Speaker D: So. [00:27:16] Speaker C: Other questions, comments, responses? [00:27:19] Speaker D: Anybody? Dennis Online has a question. [00:27:22] Speaker F: Okay, thank you for your talk this morning. Could you. A few words on the passing of that generation of who's really the foundation of our tradition in this country. I mean, they're all dying at this point. Not all. Well, we all will, but I guess many. We all are everything. [00:27:45] Speaker D: We all are. [00:27:46] Speaker F: But, yes, that generation is now passing. And could you just. Any thoughts on that? Thank you. [00:27:52] Speaker C: Yeah. So, yes, the generation who founded Tassajara, who were first Zen students, some are still around. Lou Richmond is around. Paul Disco is still around. Reb is still around. Ed Brown is still around. But yeah, they. Ed was one of. Was maybe the first person at Tassajara [00:28:19] Speaker D: because he had been there before it became his end center. He was the cook there and is famous now for his cooking book and bread book. And. [00:28:28] Speaker C: But they're all, you know, what, in their 80s or whatever. And yeah, they they, like I said, they. They were not Zen zombies. They were not just going through the motions. They were not just looking like everybody else. [00:28:49] Speaker D: They were particular people. [00:28:51] Speaker C: They were each, each one was individual. And I don't know, maybe at first they were following the forms and just [00:28:59] Speaker D: being like, like Xen automatons or something. [00:29:02] Speaker C: But yeah, that, that generation. There's still some people who were from [00:29:10] Speaker D: around from then who knew Suzuki Roshi. But yeah, there are. They're passing away and they helped establish actually, you know, that the, the ones [00:29:24] Speaker C: in San Francisco are all up in Enso Village now. They've retired or, well, or are still, still teaching at Green Gulch, but they [00:29:38] Speaker D: drive down from Enso Village, which is up in Ukiah. [00:29:41] Speaker C: So anyway, it's, it's an interesting time and, and all the people who, who followed them are. [00:29:52] Speaker D: We're getting older too. [00:29:54] Speaker C: And, and. But, you know, when I first started practicing, there was San Francisco Zen center and Green Gulch and Tassahara and then, [00:30:04] Speaker D: you know, a few other places, but not many. A little New York Zen center that I attended, which nobody remembers. But anyway, Ada Roshi's place anyway, that [00:30:17] Speaker C: now thanks to people like Hougetsu and [00:30:21] Speaker D: Yan and you know, there are. [00:30:24] Speaker C: There are Zen centers, Zen places all [00:30:27] Speaker D: over the country, all over the world, actually in New Orleans and in Vermont and in Brooklyn and Chapel Hill. [00:30:35] Speaker C: Pat Phelan was one of the first to move out of California. So she's set up the Chapel Hill Zen Center, Houston. [00:30:46] Speaker D: Galen's down in Houston. [00:30:48] Speaker C: So there, there are small centers like this and smaller than this in many, many places now. So Suki Roshi started something when he, when he. The first generation of Zen students were like hippies from the, from San Francisco. It was, it was kind of wild. [00:31:10] Speaker D: People like Isam, who was a drag [00:31:13] Speaker C: queen and had founded a commune in San Francisco, but he became a Zen priest and a Zen teacher and founded [00:31:23] Speaker D: Isanji, which is a satellite zendo in San Francisco. [00:31:28] Speaker C: There are many, many, many, many, many Zen places in California, just Northern California. [00:31:35] Speaker D: Sukiroshi. Southern California is more my Zoomi country. [00:31:40] Speaker C: Anyway, it's. So it spread and here we are. [00:31:46] Speaker D: Here we are in Chicago and you [00:31:50] Speaker C: are inheritors of this tradition. So we see Tsazen and we find how to be ourselves. So thank you for the question. [00:32:01] Speaker D: Vamos. I could say more, but I'll leave it at that. Other comments, questions, responses about this long lineage of. From Suzuki Roshi. Suki Roshi came to the Bay Area 1961. Well, he actually came in 59, but. [00:32:21] Speaker C: But he established Zen center in 61. [00:32:23] Speaker D: So long time ago, before most of you were born. [00:32:30] Speaker B: You know, I have a follow up. I think people can hear me to Dennis's question, and that is that, you know, not to stir the product too much, but pretty much everyone you mentioned were white males and microphone. [00:32:47] Speaker C: Well, there was Yvonne, Rand and Blanche. [00:32:49] Speaker B: But yeah, but this is like an aside, right? [00:32:53] Speaker G: Like, yeah, yeah, like. [00:32:54] Speaker B: Like until I brought up, there's a couple women kind of, you know, both, you know, Blanche and Yvonne I studied with. I received my rock pursuit from Yvonne. [00:33:04] Speaker C: Right. [00:33:04] Speaker B: So I know those, those people. I mean, I know all these people from some experience, but it's, you know, it's been sort of a co on for me, you know, on my lineage papers, I'm the first, the only female all the way down from Shakyamini Buddha. And, you know, with this generational shift, because, you know, the generation that Chadwick and some of these others are in is really, they weren't involved in Zen center for many years, except somewhat peripherally. And so there's another generation sort of after them that sort of is this one that's retiring now. So we have this huge generational shift. And I'm just interested in how it meets the moment in our time and place. I think it met the moment in the 60s in that time and place. But. But I'm just curious, Tigan, what your thoughts are on that? [00:33:59] Speaker C: Well, I have this. [00:33:59] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, you have that. [00:34:01] Speaker C: Yeah, no, that's true. So, yeah, there are a number of women here now, which is wonderful. And Ogetsu is our woman teacher at Ancient Dragon Zen Gate. [00:34:15] Speaker D: And there are no black people here now. [00:34:18] Speaker C: So still there are black sanghas actually [00:34:22] Speaker D: in the Bay Area and elsewhere, but it's still mostly white, mostly middle class [00:34:31] Speaker C: people who have time to do zazen, you know, and. But yeah, actually Blanche was my shuso teacher, so I have a ketchign yaku from Blanche. So. But there were. There were other women. So the, the first generation at Tassahara. So David's book Tassajara Stories is about the early years of Tassajara. [00:34:54] Speaker D: And there were numbers of women who [00:34:57] Speaker C: were at the first practice period at Tassajara, but not so many of them became priests. Adela, who is mentioned, I remember very well. She used to sit in the gaiton [00:35:15] Speaker D: at City center, and she sat in [00:35:18] Speaker C: a chair and she was like an old grandmother back then and just wonderful and very sweet. And Oksan also was at Zen center [00:35:32] Speaker D: for many, many years. [00:35:33] Speaker C: Tsukiroshi's Wife was called OK San, which means wife by many of us. And Mitsu Suzuki, she lived to be at, like, 101. She went. [00:35:45] Speaker B: She lived at Sencentre much longer than her husband did. [00:35:47] Speaker C: Yeah, she continued and taught in her own way. [00:35:51] Speaker B: Yeah, she was taught, but she also. Her presence. [00:35:54] Speaker C: Yes. She was very much present at Zen center after Suki Roshi died, and she [00:36:00] Speaker D: just stayed there for many, many, many [00:36:02] Speaker C: years, into the 2000s, I think, and went back to Japan and, you know, [00:36:11] Speaker D: lived to be 101 or 2 or 3, anyway. Yeah. [00:36:15] Speaker C: But she taught tea, and she was. As a tea teacher, she was fierce, actually, you know, tea ceremony, as it's [00:36:24] Speaker D: called in America, chado way of food [00:36:27] Speaker C: and is a very particular practice. It involves many movements and there. And very, very definite movements. And so she was a very fierce tea teacher. I can't sit Seiza. So I. I took tea with her [00:36:47] Speaker D: for a little while, but then I couldn't. [00:36:49] Speaker E: But. [00:36:50] Speaker C: But she was. She had an apartment at San Francisco [00:36:54] Speaker D: Zen center, and people would go and [00:36:56] Speaker C: have tea with her, you know, informally. [00:37:00] Speaker D: And so she was. [00:37:02] Speaker C: She was a presence. She would walk through the halls swinging [00:37:05] Speaker D: her arms for her exercise, and she. [00:37:09] Speaker C: Anyway, so she. So. Yeah, but. But it's true that for the most part, until this generation, Zen, there was a macho thing to Zen and that this story about Suzuki Roshi going around [00:37:24] Speaker D: and hitting everybody, you know, might be part of that. But. Yeah, now we are softer, gentler, and kindness is all, is always there. So. [00:37:38] Speaker C: Yes. [00:37:38] Speaker D: Zach just had a note about Charlotte. [00:37:42] Speaker C: Oh, yes, yes, yes. Yeah. [00:37:46] Speaker D: What is the note? [00:37:47] Speaker B: Well, not in our lineage, so to speak, but Charlotte Toko back, of course, was maybe one of the most independent and influential female teachers of that generation. [00:38:03] Speaker C: Yes. Yes. She was a disciple of Myzumi Roshi at CCLA until things broke there and [00:38:12] Speaker D: she broke with him. [00:38:13] Speaker C: But she was in San Diego for many years. And when you said. You said Charlotte Joko Beck, Charlotte Silver was a teacher of. She was very, very prevalent at Zen [00:38:30] Speaker D: center when I was there. [00:38:31] Speaker B: Sensory awareness. [00:38:32] Speaker C: Sensory awareness. Picking up a rock and feeling it and really sensing it and spending time [00:38:40] Speaker D: with it or being aware of, I [00:38:44] Speaker C: don't know, just whatever was happening in [00:38:47] Speaker D: the room was her teaching. [00:38:50] Speaker B: I think Charlotte Silver really was somebody who was just at that crest of, like, somatic therapies and really opening the body and having an embodied practice. [00:39:02] Speaker C: Yes. [00:39:02] Speaker B: You know, opening the sense gates, which sometimes the zennies could be a little uptight. [00:39:06] Speaker D: Yes. [00:39:07] Speaker B: So she challenged them a little to be in their bodies fully. [00:39:12] Speaker D: Yes. Yes. She was great. [00:39:16] Speaker C: Other questions or comments, please, Online. [00:39:20] Speaker B: Oh, might be time. [00:39:23] Speaker D: Oh, okay. [00:39:24] Speaker B: And I was thinking, too, that just so everybody knows that, you know, we'll end with the four vows and some announcements, but after, after we end things in the zendo, usually we have soji or work clean, temple cleaning. But we're going to have first, we're going to have tea and treat, so we can have some conversation with Teigen and. [00:39:48] Speaker D: Okay, great. [00:39:48] Speaker B: That's okay. [00:39:49] Speaker C: Sure. [00:39:50] Speaker B: Okay. And then maybe we'll do the four vows and. Yeah, Jerry. Oh, Tigan usually starts at beings are [00:40:04] Speaker C: numberless, we vow to free them. Delusions are inexhaustible, we vow to cut through them. [00:40:17] Speaker G: Dharma gates are boundless, we vow to enter them. Buddha's way is unsurpassable, we vow to realize it. Beings are numberless, we vow to freedom. Delusions are inexhaustible, we vow to cut through them. Dharma gates are boundless, we vow to enter them. Buddha's way is unsurpassable, we vow to realize it. [00:41:06] Speaker D: Being [00:41:08] Speaker C: numberless, we vow to free them. [00:41:14] Speaker G: Delusions are inexhaustible, we vow to cut through them. Dharma gates are boundless, we vow to enter them. Buddha's way is unsurpassable, we vow to realize that. [00:41:38] Speaker B: And Tigan, I want to, before we get into announcements, thank you very much for sharing your deep experience in our lineage and our family style. You know, it's like, you know, we have a tradition of telling tales. You know, we tell them of people who lived thousand years ago, 2,000 years ago, and maybe only 50. [00:41:58] Speaker C: Yes. [00:41:59] Speaker B: So thank you so much for joining us. [00:42:01] Speaker C: Thank you for inviting me.